554 | The Floor

0:20Every little thing you think that you need Every little thing you think that you need Every little thing that's just feeding your greed Oh, I bet that you'd be fine without it Yes, the minimalists Joshua Fields Milburn here TK Coleman over there Today's guest is a special guest.

0:47We have a minimalist YouTuber mom of two and Japanese floor sleeping enthusiast Please welcome to the show our new friend Natasha Teresa yes yes now the reason I wanted you to to be here today is for the last year I've been trying this thing called floor sleeping or Japanese floor sleeping or maybe you call it minimalist sleeping and there are a bunch of ways to approach it but then I also wanted to bring you into our world so on page one we'll sort of focus on some questions around floor sleeping but then the rest of the episode we're gonna spend talking about minimalism and decluttering and donation bags and all kinds of fun things that we have planned for you so I've got something to chew on first TK I'm gonna pass this one to you comfort is a wonderful servant but a terrible master what does that mean to you I love it it just means that although comfort is not some great evil to to be avoided at all costs it's it's also not the thing you want to lead with so there are two different ways you can try to like determine your activity you can say what's worth doing and what's the most comfortable way to do that and that's a good way to start things but you could also say what's the most comfortable way to be and then you can restrict what's worth doing to that and when you lead with comfort and you restrict your creative expression to what works within what makes you feel comfortable you tend to limit yourself because sometimes we have to challenge ourselves to be uncomfortable in order to discover the most interesting parts about ourselves and others so comfortable comfort is fantastic i remember talking to a an old mentor of mine and i says you know i really want to do this but i'm afraid that i just want to be comfortable and he says hey man there's nothing wrong with comfort right he's like if we were having this conversation like in the middle of antarctica right now it'd be pretty hard to focus it's okay to be comfortable you just don't want to lead with it i also think that comfort is perspectival the things that make you uncomfortable right now may just be something you're not used to and i'm sure that's going to come up quite a bit here at the beginning of the episode natasha we're going to be talking about doing some things that maybe we weren't used to because we're used to doing things one way the quote unquote comfortable way and so maybe the the discomfort that we experience is just a byproduct of the way that we've always done things so let's dive right into our callers 406-219-7839 if you'd like to join the show or you can head on over to our website theminemalists.com slash podcast you can record a voice memo right there on our website from your phone or your computer really simple and easy theminalists.com slash podcast our first question today is from jasmine hi my name is jasmine i'm calling from connecticut i've been experimenting with floor sleeping for a few weeks using just a few comforters with a grounding mat on top but i'm looking to improve my sleep and fix my lower back pain so how long did it take for you to notice the benefits and what pros and cons have you experienced and do you have any tips for making it more comfortable natasha let's start with you first off why in the hell would anyone even consider floor sleeping and what is it floor okay so floor sleeping for me it's just basically sleeping on a firmer surface it happens to be on the floor like i mean technically there's like some cushion above the floor but it's usually a firmer surface than like our typical mattresses you know the ones you spend like thousands of dollars on you know the name brand stuff so like it um for whatever reason like i decided to get into it because originally i had a very expensive name brand mattress and i was using it for a few years and i was convinced that this was the best for my back but every day i was waking up more sore like i would go to bed feeling all right and then i'd wake up sore in the morning like i had worked out but i hadn't i was just sleeping supposedly you know so i um i felt like there was a disconnect with that and then that's kind of what got me down this like rabbit hole of like are there other options out there and somehow i fell upon like japanese floor futons and i was like how are they like getting such good sleep on this thin cushion that they just put on the floor and how is everybody in japan obviously it's not everyone but there's a large swath of people so it's not abnormal there even though it's abnormal to us yeah and it's like they've been doing that what for centuries right like that's just how it is and so western mattresses are like tech they're more that's a newer thing yeah and so um i that's kind of how i got i was like well the japanese people especially like in the blue zones they're all very like sprightly like the old the old people like the nine they're like 90 years old or whatever and they can get up and down from the ground like do the deep squats everything and i'm like what what are they doing different over there that you know what why are we why are we having such trouble getting out of a chair so i was kind of like let me just explore this some more and that's kind of what led me down the whole rabbit hole um how'd you find it first was it mike chang yeah i'm gonna it was yeah i'm gonna say it was mike chang i'm gonna say yeah we'll we'll just credit it to him because he was like sleeping straight like really like on a rug like a flut like um some kind of rug on the floor and he's like yeah i love the floor like now my muscles are so hard and he's like knocking on he's like knocking his uh joints all on the floor like yeah and i'm like what how could and but also he's very muscular i was like well wait but his the thing with him is he's like i felt you know i've been working out for years and i felt so buff and everything you know i'm great i feel great i feel great but why can't why do i have trouble like like being on a firm surface because he tried sitting on the floor and he's like why is why does this hurt so much right and so he's like you know i'm doing all the things to be fit and stuff but i can't just sit on a floor like why is this not why is this not working so i think that's why he started like experimenting with just laying on a firmer surface and over time he noticed that his muscles got stronger or he felt better and he felt more in alignment so then that's when i was like well i want to be big and strong and buff like mike king one day you know no just keep it i was like well okay he's doing it his whole family's doing it like maybe i should just try it out because what i'm doing is not working if i'm waking up sore every morning it just i was just like why am i spending all this money on this expensive mattress and yeah so i i find that for me i don't recommend it to anyone there are two reasons the first reason is that it's such a far leap for most people that why and i'm also not trying to convince anyone of anything but i also feel like it'd be almost criminal for me not to mention it that's why i wanted to bring you in to do an episode because i've experienced so many benefits from doing it over the last year and even with my family i never told my wife bex i was telling you off camera it's so funny if you ever want to know what bex is like her personality is so much like natasha's we were watching some of her videos on floor sleeping early on and uh bex like why do i like her so much because she's you it's the same person it's just on the screen and my point is that she was super open to it to having me do it but i was never even i never even thought that she would want to do it she's the healthiest person i know super fit and i was like i need to do this because i've got this pinched nerve in my neck and it's been causing the shoulder pain i've tried a bunch of stuff and i need to try this out i think it's worth trying and i saw mike chang i saw some of your videos some other people and i said i'm just going to try this out on my own and i did and i was just i got a little mattress topper put on the floor because same what mike chang did i wouldn't do that again the same way i definitely just get a japanese futon but and we could talk about what we use and and and different tools to implement if you're interested in trying it but i started doing it and the pain started dissipating in areas i didn't even know there was pain and i realized oh i'm waking up i need less sleep and i'm waking up in a way that i feel more refreshed but the best part for me the number one reason is i had this pain in my neck and it's gone it's reduced 70 to 80 percent at this point and it's made it much more manageable i i played that mike chang video here on the podcast before so we're not going to play that again but i want to play a different video for people who are just sort of unfamiliar with what this is and it sounds crazy to them maybe we can review that because i wonder whether floor sleeping is maybe the most minimalist form of sleeping check out this video this is exactly how to transition from your thick unhealthy mattress to the floor safely and without discomfort i've made other videos on the countless benefits of sleeping on a firm surface and this video is about the tangible steps that you can take today to do it successfully you see most people try sleeping on the floor for one night complain that it hurt and then they never do it again and so they lose out on all of the benefits of floor sleeping so instead follow this protocol step number one is to remove your bed frame and place your mattress directly on the floor this alone will improve your sleep and you will experience greater stability no movement sway or elevation and no artificial bounciness that you get from bed frames your body immediately feels safer and more grounded sleep like this for a whole week before moving on to the next step and step number two is to transition off of the mattress remove the mattress entirely and create a comfortable bed setup on the floor using what you've got blankets pillows duvet spare bedding layer them to create a comfortable but firm surface this will serve as your transition bed here you will experience an adjustment period where you may wake up in the middle of the night a little bit stiff from being in one position for too long this is natural this is your body realigning enjoy the adjustment period and stick with it step three is to reduce the padding when you feel comfortable start removing layers so that your bed becomes gradually more firm you may end up with just a thin blanket or a rug or sleeping directly on the carpet your body will start adapting and things will start to open up for you your shoulders loosen your spine realigns your hips open your rib cage expands your breathing deepens and you drop into much deeper sleep cycles and step four is to create the fully firm surface by now you are ready to sleep on a hard surface safely and without discomfort this could look like a cotton or wool rug a wooden floor with minimal padding or sheepskins which is the gold standard which is what i've been sleeping on for years your sleep will now become incredibly deep and restorative trust in this process and you will soon wake up with no stiffness no pain and a level of alignment and clarity that you have never experienced it sounds crazy but the farmer's surface will now feel more comfortable than a mattress and if you ever spend a night on a mattress again you'll notice immediately how much nicer the farmer's surface feels you can never go back now if you want my full floor sleeping my entire does this sound crazy to you it sounds intriguing to me and i have a few questions about this first what do you all do when you travel particularly like if you go to a hotel and you may not feel comfortable sleeping on the floor there i'll start with you um it depends how long i'm staying there for first a lot of hotels they they have like firmer mattresses like lately that i've been noticing so it's like not horrible i'm usually okay for like a day or two on it but if it gets really bad then i will just take all of the comforters all the blankets and i'll put them on the floor i'll check the floor make sure it's safe enough right you know like but um i might just put everything on the floor and just sleep on the floor but usually if it's just like two or three days i just i kind of just tough it out okay yeah yeah it's amazing though you have to tough it out you feel that difference yeah yeah because yeah yeah after the first night i feel a little more sore already and i'm like huh you know i already missed my bed at home you know or my you know my floor futon at home so yeah does your answer differ it no it's pretty much the same i i i try not to be dogmatic about it when i'm out on tour and there's a hotel i'm gonna sleep in the bed that i have there and it is i've noticed it's just slightly less comfortable because and that's the thing about comfort when you make that big transition the thing that is uncomfortable becomes the new default and now that is is comfortable and and really what i did is i felt like i subtracted the excess minimalism and it that subtraction revealed what my comfort was sort of covering up or concealing right the the the comfort of the bed and when bex noticed the benefits of me she was like maybe i should try this out too i'm like hey i don't know and she's like okay this let me let me let me see and so she tried out she's like i kind of like this my i didn't realize i really had a little bit of pain in my hips and that's starting to go away the thing for her that was amazing is she started noticing that i feel safer closer to the ground wow and i i don't know why that is but physiologically she said i feel safer and here's the strange thing you know i grew up really poor my brother and i used to sleep on the floor when we were kids we had a futon like a college dorm looking futon and both of us preferred sleeping on the floor than that and so it was kind of a treat to sleep on the floor while the other one slept on the futon that was up on these terrible rails and stuff so i i find that that we i don't know we we we take on this new comfort of the bed sometimes because well that's the thing you're supposed to do and when that's the thing you're supposed to do then you have to have the nicest possible one i had a really really really nice mattress that eventually i got rid of because it was literally a pain in the neck so it has to be the case that at one point that's how we slept this is how the animals don't have a bed so how did we get to this point where we not only started sleeping on beds but we became convinced that this is the most reasonable way to sleep do either of you know anything about that the history of this i know a little bit and you tell me maybe you could fill in some gaps here but the the the first thing is that there are 100 billion people have lived on earth and what maybe 98 billion of them 97 billion of them slept not on mattresses so whether that is a japanese futon or you got this guy sleeping on lambskins or or rugs or whatever they weren't sleeping on mattresses now i don't think that alone is a good enough case to say that we shouldn't have mattresses it could be that mattresses then improved our sleep overall right and so i i think that's at least worth noting just because most people did something one way doesn't mean that's necessarily the best way to do it in perpetuity although i do think it is a signal to to pay attention to oh wow okay we kind of evolved this way to sleep on firmer surfaces and so i think a few hundred years ago from what i understand is we started introducing like the queen ann beds to avoid bugs and especially rodents uh to keep us from not getting bit by the rats that might be in the castle so to speak yes that that's exactly well according to the research that i did as well yeah that's that's what i was noticing it's more of like being able to sleep elevated off the floors kind of like it kind of signified your status at the time too right so like royalty you know like no nobility they they had that opportunity to not be on the floor with the rodents and everything so yeah that's that makes a lot of sense yeah yeah that's as far as i got with my research i mean that that that satisfies my question that's that's good enough yeah yeah so when i see this and he takes it even further than you and i do i have uh we're actually working on making our bedroom so eventually we got rid of the bed after bex decided she liked it here's the interesting thing my 13 year old daughter uh last year when she was 12 she would come in there and she now she's saying oh i want to do this too i've never said you need to do this or i want you to do this she's like can i get rid of my bed and and also do this it's so fun for her it's it's play yes and you realize that it's much more comfortable for her to play on that surface and it actually expands the size of the room do your kids yes they sleep on the floor they prefer it they prefer it um like yeah actually when they were like toddlers i used to instead of having them in the crib or whatever or like well i guess what when they're one one or two years old i i felt safer having them on like a floor futon back then but i didn't make that connection yet i just knew it was easier for me because like say they woke up in the middle of the night it's easier for me to also just lay on the floor futon with them and i think like a lot of families can you know they like it for that reason too like for co-sleeping if they do that so it made it easier for me to go in and console them and then if i fall asleep it's all good we both on the floor is you know what i mean as opposed to like they in the crib and i'm like trying to go to sleep so that i can go to sleep so actually it's better it was actually a lot better for us back then when they were younger too and we kind of just fell away from that because we were like oh well they're older now they should have like a cute kid bed they should have like the bed frames everything should look cute you know and so we kind of fell away from that but then we started moving a lot because um at some point i got into real estate and i wanted to house hack so we started we had to minimize our stuff so that we could move from place to place and so it came it was like whoa i have to we have too many bed frames we're like setting up this bed everywhere there's not enough space so that's kind of what also pushed us back into like here here's like you know sleep on the floor here here's a floor futon and so the but the kids love it because they can really easily play on the floor like we can have you know bedtime stories on the floor like it's easier i don't know it's easier and then being on their level you know they love when their parents like kids love when you're down on the floor with them right like they love that it's like you're you see eye to eye with them and you can connect with them better i feel like so it was it's i think they feel the same way too as like what um your wife was saying like she feels safer on the floor yeah like my son actually was like when we got rid we did a video like a year or two ago where we got rid of his bed frame in the newest house and he was like yeah no i don't like having a bed frame because there could be monsters under there but you know but he was like so serious about i'm like okay you know what yeah we don't want no monsters we want to make sure you safe so that's why he likes to be on he's he's older now but yeah i think that's the best argument i've ever heard for sleeping on the floor there are no monsters yeah so you don't have one less thing to worry about so let's talk about the pros and cons here what um you you talked about less pain are there any other pros but also the bed frame i imagine tk purgatory is just you you're you show up and there's an ikea box that's an ikea bed frame and now you have to assemble this for the rest of eternity and you can't get into heaven until you finally assemble this ikea box 643 years later that'll definitely be your purgatory you'll actually get into heaven once you could start enjoying it but you know what this is all like okay i could do this forever i did figure out how to enjoy it i brought nicodemus over and made him do most of it and uh that that was always my ikea plan was to have him build my furniture while i pretended to just look confused at the instructions so this is another argument for